De-Pressing

Discussing comic book grading and restoration issues. This includes evaluations of specific comics, discussions of general grading and/or restoration techniques, etc..
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De-Pressing

Postby zippitydoodah » Sat Nov 15, 2014 3:48 am

OK ... you pay the money and youse takes yer chances ...The book is freshly pressed ... it is immaculately groomed for inspection by the professional presser grade it now ... right now ... it will never get any better than this. It's like a man at the start of the day he is clean and fresh and his teeth are brushed ....

BUT

It goes into a shipping pile by the presser than waits and waiths in a safe and it waits some more ... and it waits ... and it waits. It is actually starting to repress or de-press in it's new pile ... as it waits and waits. Maybe it just naturally loosens up.

That same man who started the day as fresh and sharp as a tack with scope breath ... now needs a breath mint and he has 5 o'clock shadow ... He's not quite as sharp in appearance as he was at the start of the day. It seems the same could be true for a pressed comic to some extent.

What is the degree of de-pressing which can occur over a period of time?

Has anyone pressed a book a book and then just laid it down and observed any natural changes say over 3 to 6 months "de-pressing"... Is it noticeable ... measurable ... negligble? And then if you had say twenty books and put that same book in a pile for months as though it were a shipping pile ... a pile by the presser ... and let it sit for months - would it the book now take on new and potentially negative characteristics of the pile ... as though it were sitting in a vault for months waiting to be graded?

A lot can happen to a book between pressing and grading ... but I'm not talking about anything major ... I'm just talking about re-laxing - de-pressing.... I get depressed just thinking that my books could literally be going to lower grades sitting in a safe ... as they are surely in some sort of pile.

Books waiting so long to get graded I suspicion can only be a negative ... any thoughts?

My preference - in a perfect world - would be no pressing and this is a non issue, but in the real world this is an issue and then ...

My preference would be to press it and literally have it graded on the spot ... like fresh bread - surely it would be better.

My realistic hope would be to press it and get it graded in short order like a month or less ... emphasis on the less.

My last and least favorite is what we have now ... press it and let it go for months in a pile of other books however or other the presser shipped it ... waiting for months to get looked at - as the book re-presses in it's shipping home for months before a grader ever looks at it ... perhaps becoming a half grade lower?

Perhaps this is all just x-files ... or maybe there is something to it. Time matters more than just for curiousity sake and making faster sales ... it may very well matter to the core of the business - grading? If we could all afford it - next day grading would be the way to go I suppose - but here we wait - we pays our money and takes our chances.



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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Gaz973 » Sat Nov 15, 2014 4:24 am

I've heard people say that books do revert from pressing after a time. Having an active dislike for pressing, I've never had any books pressed to witness this myself. I know that Bomber Bob on the CGC boards has mentioned it before.

The thing is, what is the point in having a book encapsulated as a 9.8 if it is going to revert back to a 9.6 anyway? The only reason to do it then is to make money on it but that's not really fair on the buyer that it's sold to. I don't know how many or how much comics can revert back but I've heard people who are pro pressing talking about it as fact so I would think that there is definitely something to it.

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Stu_Pidman » Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:06 am

Gaz973 wrote:I've heard people say that books do revert from pressing after a time. Having an active dislike for pressing, I've never had any books pressed to witness this myself. I know that Bomber Bob on the CGC boards has mentioned it before.

The thing is, what is the point in having a book encapsulated as a 9.8 if it is going to revert back to a 9.6 anyway? The only reason to do it then is to make money on it but that's not really fair on the buyer that it's sold to. I don't know how many or how much comics can revert back but I've heard people who are pro pressing talking about it as fact so I would think that there is definitely something to it.


I've read posts from RMA stating that he always checks for comics reverting before he sends the final product out, and that comics can definitely revert. I'll see if I can find the thread.

Pressing sucks! If CGC wasn't so greedy, they could've really helped the hobby out by being anti-pressing when they started, but since Borock likes pressing so much, it wasn't to be. Now CGC has helped screw up the hobby even more. Thanks assholes!
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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Stu_Pidman » Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:17 am

zippitydoodah wrote:OK ... you pay the money and youse takes yer chances ...The book is freshly pressed ... it is immaculately groomed for inspection by the professional presser grade it now ... right now ... it will never get any better than this.


I dunno. According to Borock, can any comic really reach it's true "maximum potential"? (A term he coined :lol: )

It's like a man at the start of the day he is clean and fresh and his teeth are brushed ....

BUT

It goes into a shipping pile by the presser than waits and waiths in a safe and it waits some more ... and it waits ... and it waits. It is actually starting to repress or de-press in it's new pile ... as it waits and waits. Maybe it just naturally loosens up.

That same man who started the day as fresh and sharp as a tack with scope breath ... now needs a breath mint and he has 5 o'clock shadow ... He's not quite as sharp in appearance as he was at the start of the day. It seems the same could be true for a pressed comic to some extent.


I sure hope so.

What is the degree of de-pressing which can occur over a period of time?

Has anyone pressed a book a book and then just laid it down and observed any natural changes say over 3 to 6 months "de-pressing"... Is it noticeable ... measurable ... negligble? And then if you had say twenty books and put that same book in a pile for months as though it were a shipping pile ... a pile by the presser ... and let it sit for months - would it the book now take on new and potentially negative characteristics of the pile ... as though it were sitting in a vault for months waiting to be graded?


As I mentioned, RMA has and I'll see if I can find the thread I'm thinking of.

A lot can happen to a book between pressing and grading ... but I'm not talking about anything major ... I'm just talking about re-laxing - de-pressing.... I get depressed just thinking that my books could literally be going to lower grades sitting in a safe


It makes me happy to think that Pressers can get screwed over in this way.

Books waiting so long to get graded I suspicion can only be a negative ... any thoughts?

My preference - in a perfect world - would be no pressing and this is a non issue, but in the real world this is an issue and then ...

My preference would be to press it and literally have it graded on the spot ... like fresh bread - surely it would be better.


Spend the money and you can.

My realistic hope would be to press it and get it graded in short order like a month or less ... emphasis on the less.


Why? To deceive buyers?

My last and least favorite is what we have now ... press it and let it go for months in a pile of other books however or other the presser shipped it ... waiting for months to get looked at - as the book re-presses in it's shipping home for months before a grader ever looks at it ... perhaps becoming a half grade lower?


I hope so!

Perhaps this is all just x-files ... or maybe there is something to it. Time matters more than just for curiousity sake and making faster sales ... it may very well matter to the core of the business - grading? If we could all afford it - next day grading would be the way to go I suppose - but here we wait - we pays our money and takes our chances.


Flippers and speculators suck!
"Honesty is my only excuse, try to rob me of it but it's no use." Metallica :rockout:

"Comics are a commodity, thank God!" SpideManOnTilt

Why are some comic collectors so proud to have fake OCD? Is it cool to pretend to be mentally ill?

"These CGC Comics in Auction #215 are better than stocks and bonds when it comes to making an investment for the future!" - CGC Facebook page :roll:

"Why do people think 9.6 is not a great grade? 9.6 is NM+. When I was collecting comics, that was a fantastic grade." Steve Borock irony 5/2016

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby murph0 » Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:30 am

Stu_Pidman wrote:Pressing sucks! If CGC wasn't so greedy, they could've really helped the hobby out by being anti-pressing when they started, but since Borock likes pressing so much, it wasn't to be. Now CGC has helped screw up the hobby even more. Thanks assholes!


What is your solution for detecting it consistently? You might catch the ones that are poorly done but most books pressed any more are done by people who know what they're doing. I'm not a fan of having a grader make a guess on whether a book is pressed or not.
I didn't mind pressing when it was occurring by a few people on some "press-worthy" candidates but now anybody and everybody is pressing anything they can get their hands on. It's almost at the point where you might as well just assume any high grade book you've purchased has been pressed, whether the pressing was necessary or not.

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Stu_Pidman » Sat Nov 15, 2014 6:28 am

murph0 wrote:
Stu_Pidman wrote:Pressing sucks! If CGC wasn't so greedy, they could've really helped the hobby out by being anti-pressing when they started, but since Borock likes pressing so much, it wasn't to be. Now CGC has helped screw up the hobby even more. Thanks assholes!


What is your solution for detecting it consistently? You might catch the ones that are poorly done but most books pressed any more are done by people who know what they're doing. I'm not a fan of having a grader make a guess on whether a book is pressed or not.


Not even talking about being able to detect it - although one of my favorite sayings is "if Borock hated pressing as much as he loves it, we'd be able to detect pressing by now". No, what I'm talking about is how CGC should have handled it right from the beginning. CGC should have come out against pressing on January 1, 2000. They should've try to deter people from doing it. They should've labeled books that they knew (100%) were pressed. I wouldn't even have minded if they lied about it, saying "we're working on a process to detect pressing and will be downgrading for it". Ends justify the means in this case.
But of course, all this would've taken away their CPR revenue stream, so there's no way CGC would've done what was best for the hobby in the first place. The health of the hobby is not CGC's concern, never has been.
"Honesty is my only excuse, try to rob me of it but it's no use." Metallica :rockout:

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Why are some comic collectors so proud to have fake OCD? Is it cool to pretend to be mentally ill?

"These CGC Comics in Auction #215 are better than stocks and bonds when it comes to making an investment for the future!" - CGC Facebook page :roll:

"Why do people think 9.6 is not a great grade? 9.6 is NM+. When I was collecting comics, that was a fantastic grade." Steve Borock irony 5/2016

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Sleemo » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:24 am

:welcome: zippitydoodah :welcome:

Are we gonna need plastic surgery to remove our Goddamn smiles?

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby slym2none » Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:24 am

murph0 wrote: It's almost at the point where you might as well just assume any high grade book you've purchased has been pressed


Yup.



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Re: De-Pressing

Postby murph0 » Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:14 am

Stu_Pidman wrote:Not even talking about being able to detect it - although one of my favorite sayings is "if Borock hated pressing as much as he loves it, we'd be able to detect pressing by now". No, what I'm talking about is how CGC should have handled it right from the beginning. CGC should have come out against pressing on January 1, 2000. They should've try to deter people from doing it. They should've labeled books that they knew (100%) were pressed. I wouldn't even have minded if they lied about it, saying "we're working on a process to detect pressing and will be downgrading for it". Ends justify the means in this case.


What you're suggesting just creates another "gotcha" type system for CGC detractors to rail on. So they guess on a book and say it's pressed. The book gets submitted next month and they guess this time that it's not pressed. Submitter immediately posts to CGC forum crying of unfairness and nefarious goings on. Pressing detection should be all or nothing, otherwise you have another scenario like the Golden Age books that sometimes get blue labels despite having some restoration at CGC's discrepancy.

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Stu_Pidman » Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:47 am

murph0 wrote:
Stu_Pidman wrote:Not even talking about being able to detect it - although one of my favorite sayings is "if Borock hated pressing as much as he loves it, we'd be able to detect pressing by now". No, what I'm talking about is how CGC should have handled it right from the beginning. CGC should have come out against pressing on January 1, 2000. They should've try to deter people from doing it. They should've labeled books that they knew (100%) were pressed. I wouldn't even have minded if they lied about it, saying "we're working on a process to detect pressing and will be downgrading for it". Ends justify the means in this case.


What you're suggesting just creates another "gotcha" type system for CGC detractors to rail on. So they guess on a book and say it's pressed. The book gets submitted next month and they guess this time that it's not pressed. Submitter immediately posts to CGC forum crying of unfairness and nefarious goings on. Pressing detection should be all or nothing, otherwise you have another scenario like the Golden Age books that sometimes get blue labels despite having some restoration at CGC's discrepancy.


You misunderstand me Murph. I don't (didn't) want CGC to guess on books, hell, I didn't even necessarily want them to actually put it on the label (unless it's 100%, as mentioned). I wanted them to make people THINK that books could be downgraded for any kind of pressing. Right from the start, they could've made several announcements that would've deterred people from pressing books. And it didn't have to be lies, it could've been "stretched truth". CGC could've said they're working on a method to detect pressing (doesn't have to be 100%, just like their Resto detection is never touted as "100%"). Now, that wouldn't be a lie because CGC does try to stay on top of detecting pressing, even if it's only bad pressing. Year after year they could've said "we're still working on it" and the Pressers would never know when the other shoe would drop. I mean, we know CGC was going to lie to us one way or another (as 15 years has shown), why couldn't they have lied to help the hobby instead of lying to help the flippers and speculators? Rhetorical question :roll:

Not changing the definition of "restoration" would've been another step in the right direction. "Nothing added"??? Total CGC bullshit.

Stuff like that. Not even stuff that needed to be actually implemented, but just the threat of it being implemented would've helped.

"If Borock hated pressing as much as he loves it, we'd be able to detect it reliably by now".
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Why are some comic collectors so proud to have fake OCD? Is it cool to pretend to be mentally ill?

"These CGC Comics in Auction #215 are better than stocks and bonds when it comes to making an investment for the future!" - CGC Facebook page :roll:

"Why do people think 9.6 is not a great grade? 9.6 is NM+. When I was collecting comics, that was a fantastic grade." Steve Borock irony 5/2016

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby murph0 » Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:01 am

I guess I don't see how that would in any way be a deterrent. Continually saying they're working on a remedy just sounds like the boy who cried wolf, say it enough times and no one is going to believe you. So pressers would still submit their books, see that they're getting the grades they expect and go about their business. Even if we assumed CGC were to claim they were detecting pressing from the get-go, pressers would still test them and still see that not to be the case and then let everyone else know (on the CGC forums, as usual). Pressing businesses would still open up, people would still submit their books to pressers, and so on. Unless you can detect it all the time, there's no plausible scenario where CGC would be able to successfully deter pressing.

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Gaz973 » Mon Nov 17, 2014 1:07 pm

CGC's trimming detection methods aren't 100% yet they are happy to give it their best opinion. I believe that if CGC had thought of pressing as a bad thing rather than the boost to their business that it is then they would've been trying to detect it and after all this time would've probably found ways to detect it.

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby SweetComic » Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:42 pm

I guess I suck.

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby murph0 » Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:49 pm

Gaz973 wrote:CGC's trimming detection methods aren't 100% yet they are happy to give it their best opinion. I believe that if CGC had thought of pressing as a bad thing rather than the boost to their business that it is then they would've been trying to detect it and after all this time would've probably found ways to detect it.


I guess I have never seen anyone argue that trimming is anything other than restoration? The same cannot be said for pressing. Pretty big difference between the two in as much as a company trying to get the public to accept one or the other.

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Superior Spider-Man » Mon Nov 17, 2014 6:17 pm

I understand and agree with both Stu and Murph0's stance on the pressing issue so there is no need to repeat what has already been said. The argument in the past has been, is pressing a form of restoration. The viewpoint from the pros and self-proclaimed pros I have talked to concerning restoration is, "restoration is adding to or taking a away from a book to put it back the way it was originally, or the best it can be anyway, ie: pieces added, trimming, color touch, etc." Tape is excluded because that is considered conservation. Although IMO Scotch Tape is not conservation because that particular tape deteriorates which will cause that area of the book to deteriorate as well. Using Scotch Tape is a serious faux pas.

Now, If you have a book with dents, dings, buckles, and so forth that was NOT manufactured with these defects, and you have it pressed, then what is being done is the book is being returned to its original condition,... it is being restored. Therefore Pressing Is Restoration, and cleaning is also restoration. I think the 3rd Party Grading Brains quickly came to the conclusion that if pressing cannot be detected or proven, then why not capitalize on it. And even if it can be detected, let's capitalize on it anyway because that is what the majority of collectors want. I mean, read the posts out there, people are sending books in to be pressed by the hundreds of thousands. Even if they don't plan on selling it, they want their books pressed and cleaned. It has become a standard, a preference. I'm not a big fan of pressing but nowadays if you are a collector of comics (especially the GA and SA era) that have value, then it was probably pressed. It is what it is!

De-Pressing is depressing!

Yup, I've seen quite a few books after a press (mainly SA) that have returned to their original condition. Just this past year I witnessed a key bronze (ASM 129) that I personally would have given a 7.5 grade prior to pressing. After the press it looked to be a 9.0 maybe 9.2 and within 2 weeks I gave that same book a 6.0 grade. WOW! Thankfully I didn't buy it earlier because as many of you may know, I am a 129 hoarder. I have hundreds of SA Spideys (which means many dupes) stashed away that have been pressed and even after 6 to 10 years they still maintain their condition. So evidently their defective condition was not serious and the pressing technique was more than adequate, for which I am very thankful.

Buy the book, not the label! How many times have we read this? The problem is, the buyer is paying a 7.5 gpa on a book that was a 6.0 prior to pressing. Five years later this buyer decides to sell the book but has to at a 6.0 gpa because it may have reverted back to it's original condition. Even if the book is slabbed at a 7.5 then the unlucky sucker is BUYING the book but PAYING for the label. The pressers made their money, the 3rd party graders made their money, and the LCS/flippers made their money. It's the buyer/collector who gets screwed,... that is IF the book reverts back to it's original condition. And it does happen.

So if the hobby is damaged,... then pressers, 3rd party graders, AND collectors, are all to blame! Now some may argue the point, "well I'm a collector and I don't press my books so I didn't damage the hobby!" Well, that's fine. But we all know there are many many collectors and some even Big Time that do press. Yeah, CGC could have said we are going to detect pressing and downgrade for it, but we as collectors could have also demanded that if this is not implemented then you do not get our business. Did they do it?...NO! Did we do it?...NO!

We as collectors are just as guilty for the shape that the hobby is in. Nuff Said! :thumbsup2:
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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Gaz973 » Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:23 pm

Superior Spider-Man wrote:So if the hobby is damaged,... then pressers, 3rd party graders, AND collectors, are all to blame! Now some may argue the point, "well I'm a collector and I don't press my books so I didn't damage the hobby!" Well, that's fine. But we all know there are many many collectors and some even Big Time that do press. Yeah, CGC could have said we are going to detect pressing and downgrade for it, but we as collectors could have also demanded that if this is not implemented then you do not get our business. Did they do it?...NO! Did we do it?...NO!

We as collectors are just as guilty for the shape that the hobby is in. Nuff Said! :thumbsup2:


When CGC first announced that it had been carrying out in house pressing and that they did not consider pressing to be restoration, there was a huge outcry on the CGC boards. So much so that they shelved there plans for an official launch of their in house pressing until a while back when they went with it again since the tide had turned.

The thing is that there were lots of collectors who were outraged about it and many of them after realising that money could be made, not just by the big players but also by many average collectors, decided that it wasn't so bad after all. I can see how tempting it is when you can see people raking money out of it all around you but like I said on the CGC boards last night, I'm not going to be the hypocrite who complains about pressing and then turns around and does it myself.

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby SweetComic » Tue Nov 18, 2014 5:20 am

You know what? To say flippers and speculators suck is really ignorant. There are tons of ways we get ripped off in this greedy world of ours and to try and make a few extra bucks in a particular hobby is fine with me. Look at all the other BS in the world. Go to a sporting event lately? See the ticket and food prices? Go to a gas station to put air in your tire? Walk into your local grocery store and put your can of change thru their change counter? Why does one have to pay 10% to exchange one type of money for another. Point is, we get ripped off every day by everyone. Now when we try and make a few bucks off of a few comics we suck? If thats the attitude around here i'll leave this place as fast as I signed up for it. You better re-think your words BUDDY!

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Pepto-Bismol » Tue Nov 18, 2014 5:59 am

SweetComic wrote:You know what? To say flippers and speculators suck is really ignorant. There are tons of ways we get ripped off in this greedy world of ours and to try and make a few extra bucks in a particular hobby is fine with me. Look at all the other BS in the world. Go to a sporting event lately? See the ticket and food prices? Go to a gas station to put air in your tire? Walk into your local grocery store and put your can of change thru their change counter? Why does one have to pay 10% to exchange one type of money for another. Point is, we get ripped off every day by everyone. Now when we try and make a few bucks off of a few comics we suck? If thats the attitude around here i'll leave this place as fast as I signed up for it. You better re-think your words BUDDY!

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Sleemo » Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:04 am

Nice tits ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ :lol:

Why can't they use something to measure the thickness of the paper? Micrometer, nanometer, picometer? I don't even know if they make a picometer, :P. If the thickness of the paper falls below a certain value, then the book is pressed.

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Pepto-Bismol » Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:13 am

Sleemo wrote:Nice tits ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ :lol:

Why can't they use something to measure the thickness of the paper? Micrometer, nanometer, picometer? I don't even know if they make a picometer, :P. If the thickness of the paper falls below a certain value, then the book is pressed.



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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Stu_Pidman » Tue Nov 18, 2014 2:54 pm

murph0 wrote:I guess I don't see how that would in any way be a deterrent. Continually saying they're working on a remedy just sounds like the boy who cried wolf, say it enough times and no one is going to believe you.


Well that's your opinion of course. I like to think that done correctly, subtly, and with the same underhanded deviousness they used to make the hobby accept pressing, it would've been a deterent.

So pressers would still submit their books, see that they're getting the grades they expect and go about their business.


Sure, I can agree with that, if we're talking about Matt Nelson or Susan or Marin or Friesen - people who knew what they were doing before CGC arrived. But I'm also talking about deterring the weekend warriors, the guys buying a press on Ebay and giving it a shot. Now every Tom, Dick and Douchey owns a press and is manipulating books.

Even if we assumed CGC were to claim they were detecting pressing from the get-go, pressers would still test them and still see that not to be the case and then let everyone else know (on the CGC forums, as usual).


Really? You think Matt Nelson would've come onto the CGC Board and announced that CGC's non-pressing policy was BS? I don't think so. Who of the original Pressers (who had inside info and knew about CGC's policy way before the public did) do you think would've come onthe board and shouted that?

Pressing businesses would still open up, people would still submit their books to pressers, and so on.


Maybe, maybe not. Maybe things would've happened slower, maybe things would've been more controlled, maybe things would've done a 180. CGC wasn't so successful with PCS, was it? And why was that? Because when people found out that CGC was going to be pressing books (yeah, yeah "separate companies" bullshit), and had been pressing books in-house in secret for dealers who signed a NDA, they were pissed. Maybe we could've made the hobby pissed at Pressers.

Unless you can detect it all the time, there's no plausible scenario where CGC would be able to successfully deter pressing.


CGC can't detect trimming all the time (you knew that was coming)
There's no need to be able to detect it 100% to deter people from pressing. Just make the pressers (especially amateur pressers) scared where it counts - their pocketbook. Make them think they could lose big money if their books are caught. Put a couple "cleaned and pressed" books out there so people talk. Get a few submitters who WANT the pressed notation on their slabs, and get those books into circulation. Spread the word and spread rumors, that usually has an effect.
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Why are some comic collectors so proud to have fake OCD? Is it cool to pretend to be mentally ill?

"These CGC Comics in Auction #215 are better than stocks and bonds when it comes to making an investment for the future!" - CGC Facebook page :roll:

"Why do people think 9.6 is not a great grade? 9.6 is NM+. When I was collecting comics, that was a fantastic grade." Steve Borock irony 5/2016

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Stu_Pidman » Tue Nov 18, 2014 2:59 pm

Gaz973 wrote:CGC's trimming detection methods aren't 100% yet they are happy to give it their best opinion. I believe that if CGC had thought of pressing as a bad thing rather than the boost to their business that it is then they would've been trying to detect it and after all this time would've probably found ways to detect it.


That's exactly what my quote means :thumbsup2:

"If Borock hated pressing as much as he loves it, we'd already be able to detect it".
"Honesty is my only excuse, try to rob me of it but it's no use." Metallica :rockout:

"Comics are a commodity, thank God!" SpideManOnTilt

Why are some comic collectors so proud to have fake OCD? Is it cool to pretend to be mentally ill?

"These CGC Comics in Auction #215 are better than stocks and bonds when it comes to making an investment for the future!" - CGC Facebook page :roll:

"Why do people think 9.6 is not a great grade? 9.6 is NM+. When I was collecting comics, that was a fantastic grade." Steve Borock irony 5/2016

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Stu_Pidman » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:01 pm

murph0 wrote:
Gaz973 wrote:CGC's trimming detection methods aren't 100% yet they are happy to give it their best opinion. I believe that if CGC had thought of pressing as a bad thing rather than the boost to their business that it is then they would've been trying to detect it and after all this time would've probably found ways to detect it.


I guess I have never seen anyone argue that trimming is anything other than restoration?


You've never seen the threads where people say that CGC should give trimming a different label because it's destruction and not restoration?

At least Pressing is just restoration and not destruction.
"Honesty is my only excuse, try to rob me of it but it's no use." Metallica :rockout:

"Comics are a commodity, thank God!" SpideManOnTilt

Why are some comic collectors so proud to have fake OCD? Is it cool to pretend to be mentally ill?

"These CGC Comics in Auction #215 are better than stocks and bonds when it comes to making an investment for the future!" - CGC Facebook page :roll:

"Why do people think 9.6 is not a great grade? 9.6 is NM+. When I was collecting comics, that was a fantastic grade." Steve Borock irony 5/2016

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Stu_Pidman » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:13 pm

Gaz973 wrote:
Superior Spider-Man wrote:So if the hobby is damaged,... then pressers, 3rd party graders, AND collectors, are all to blame! Now some may argue the point, "well I'm a collector and I don't press my books so I didn't damage the hobby!" Well, that's fine. But we all know there are many many collectors and some even Big Time that do press. Yeah, CGC could have said we are going to detect pressing and downgrade for it, but we as collectors could have also demanded that if this is not implemented then you do not get our business. Did they do it?...NO! Did we do it?...NO!

We as collectors are just as guilty for the shape that the hobby is in. Nuff Said! :thumbsup2:


You misunderstand, there was no way for The Hobby to demand that "if this is not implemented then you do not get our business". The Hobby had NO idea that CGC was so pro-pressing and that things like PCS and pressers like Matt Nelson were given inside information. CGC, in an underhanded and devious manner, did what Davenport (or Lou Fine?) described as the "slow roll out". They did it in a methodical and calculated manner until it was too late, there was no turning back. That's why people went crazy when they found out about PCS, but applauded CGC for buying Nelson's business. CGC likes to say they didn't lie about all this, which might be semantically true. I always thought of it more as a sin of omission. How can we ask about something we are unaware of?

And check out some OPGs before CGC went into business, Pressing was always considered restoration.
"Honesty is my only excuse, try to rob me of it but it's no use." Metallica :rockout:

"Comics are a commodity, thank God!" SpideManOnTilt

Why are some comic collectors so proud to have fake OCD? Is it cool to pretend to be mentally ill?

"These CGC Comics in Auction #215 are better than stocks and bonds when it comes to making an investment for the future!" - CGC Facebook page :roll:

"Why do people think 9.6 is not a great grade? 9.6 is NM+. When I was collecting comics, that was a fantastic grade." Steve Borock irony 5/2016

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Re: De-Pressing

Postby Stu_Pidman » Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:43 pm

SweetComic wrote:You know what? To say flippers and speculators suck is really ignorant. There are tons of ways we get ripped off in this greedy world of ours and to try and make a few extra bucks in a particular hobby is fine with me. Look at all the other BS in the world. Go to a sporting event lately? See the ticket and food prices? Go to a gas station to put air in your tire? Walk into your local grocery store and put your can of change thru their change counter? Why does one have to pay 10% to exchange one type of money for another. Point is, we get ripped off every day by everyone. Now when we try and make a few bucks off of a few comics we suck? If thats the attitude around here i'll leave this place as fast as I signed up for it. You better re-think your words BUDDY!


That's just my attitude, I don't see why you would think the whole board was like me :???: I think this is a very diverse board for being so young, so you're going to find a few people you disagree with. Take it in stride, I know I will...
"Honesty is my only excuse, try to rob me of it but it's no use." Metallica :rockout:

"Comics are a commodity, thank God!" SpideManOnTilt

Why are some comic collectors so proud to have fake OCD? Is it cool to pretend to be mentally ill?

"These CGC Comics in Auction #215 are better than stocks and bonds when it comes to making an investment for the future!" - CGC Facebook page :roll:

"Why do people think 9.6 is not a great grade? 9.6 is NM+. When I was collecting comics, that was a fantastic grade." Steve Borock irony 5/2016


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